RABBI POUPKO: Double Standard of Fighting for New York’s Yeshivas

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NEW YORK (Rabbi Elchanan Poupko / VINNews) — As the New York Board of Regents implements changes in New York’s Yeshivas, we have seen an eruption of askanim, community leaders, rabbis, and others speaking out in support of Yeshivas and against outside intervention in those.

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As someone whose family comes from Radin, I hear the echoes of the Chafetz Chaim’s strong opposition to changes made to traditional Yeshivas and Chadarim and believe that those seeking a broader education should be welcomed to do so in a different school of their choice. That being said, there is something appalling about this most recent campaign, namely: where was everyone when our kids truly needed us?

Where were the Lakewood askanim last summer when dozens of frum girls had no schools to go to? Why do we see insane stories like Sholom Rubashkin being the one getting two kids into school in Lakewood after parents could not do so for months? Where are all of those savvy askanim and people who reportedly speak for the community until now? What happens to those kids who don’t have someone like him step in for them?

Where are all of us when the most amazing bochurim and parents are repeatedly humiliated by menahalim when all they want is to get into a Yeshiva, pay full tuition, and sit and learn all day?

Where are all those (rightfully) going to war now with New York State courts and officials last year when those same courts were the only thing that stopped Bais Yaakov in Brooklyn from immorally and unlawfully removing girls whose parents began attending Reb Shaul Alter’s Kehilla?

Where are all of us when school and Yeshivas in Eretz Yisrael repeatedly and consistently reject, humiliate, and discriminate against Sephardic and Mizrachi children and their families? How are we so silent when their blood is spilled day after day, year after year?

Where is the emergency Asifa about the fact that one-third (!!!) of the people who grow up frum end up leaving our communities? Where is the emergency Asifa to make sure that those who can’t sit in Yeshiva all day or don’t fit the mold do not end up on the streets or treated with the mercilessness that our system treats them with? In fact, has anyone who has encountered the harshness of our system (most of us) ever stopped and asked what happens to those who can’t make the cut? How DO they manage?

Where are our Askanim and spokes people when the infamous Ya’asfeini organization targets families inside Gerr who decide to join R’ Shaul Alter’s community and convinces children to leave their parents? Why do we not hear more voices speaking out against the shameful practice of alienating parents from their children?

Where are we all when guys coming back from studying in Eretz Yisroel, wanting to get married and carry on with their lives, are rejected by some of the post-EY Yeshivas for random and arbitrary reasons???

Furthermore, as the NYT article elaborates on the horrifying reality of violence against kids in our Yeshivos, where is our communal outrage against the places where this does take place? How can we remain silent even in the face of a chashash that some mosdos are hurting our children? If they spoke to hundreds of people who say violence against our children is a reality, how can we just dismiss that? Why are we not all speaking out?

My hope is that from this storm, we see some calm and that the renewed interest in protecting Tinokos Shel Beis Rabban bring about care and concern for the most precious of all–our children–and not just an attempt to protect the system as it is.

The writer is an eleventh-generation rabbi, teacher and author. He has written Sacred Days on the Jewish Holidays, Poupko on the Parsha, and hundreds of articles published in five languages. He is a member of the executive committee of the Rabbinical Council of America.

The views expressed by the author do not necessarily reflect those of VIN News. 


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106 Comments
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Nathan
Nathan
1 year ago

I’m so upset that my 9 year year old son doesn’t have a yeshiva and they all give you hell and act like I’m a felon or something when I’m a simple person that was otd when I was younger before I got married and my wife who is an amazing erlicha mother person that has no smart phone or gadgets but doesn’t have a father since her parents got divorced when she was two is a nobody.

It’s sad but a part of me is happy that schools are getting a hit.

We all need redemption ASAP!

Professor Ryesky
Professor Ryesky
1 year ago

There are lots of people who guard the Torah so intensively that they will not allow anyone to come near to it!

Shoin
Shoin
1 year ago

Lol,
First of all glad you bashed Lakewood first, because obviously there’s nothing like bashing the good old Lakewood.
You see Rabbi, even though you are an excellent writer, it seems to me that you like stirring the pot.
What you said, does hold some truth, like not having a perfect acceptance system, which can sometimes be heartbreaking, and should be condemned at its fullest.
However just reading your article raises my eyebrows. You wrote quote,
Where is the emergency Asifa about the fact that one-third (!!!) of the people who grow up frum end up leaving our communities?
Umm witch community do you live in? Perhaps Lakewood? Well No, that is a complete incorrect stat. Brooklyn? Last I checked 99 percent of my school is still part of our community, functioning properly, BH.
So not sure which bubble you live in, but perhaps do some more research before making such nonsense comments, and you may actually resonate with people reading your articles.

think
think
1 year ago

this is out attiude: We are perfect, mi keamchu yisroel. we don’t tolerate internal criticism and G-D forbid criticism by outsiders like the NYT. we’ve got nothing to improve, nothing to make better. we are perfect as is. everyone who says otherwise is either an enti-semite or a self hating Jew.

For the most part we do get most things right and have nothing to be ashamed of, we don’t need to excuse ourselves to anyone. But some introspection and positive criticism from time to time is necessary for a healthy society. and that’s the problem. we don’t address the few problems we do have. we pretend everything is prefect and go into a frenzied wagon circling when anyone, even a well meaning insider like Rabbi Poupko points out some inconvenient facts

By the way Rabbi FYI, “violence against kids in our Yeshivos” in next to none existence. its so rare. im not sure why you chose to run with the NYT’s claims of violence in our Yeshivos. other than that, you bring up very important points.

Mark stein
Mark stein
1 year ago

So true there are still many many children out of a school here in the lakewood area and the askanim are nowhere to be seen ,they are all in hiding while many parents and children are crying themselves to sleep at night because they were abandoned by our community.

Shalom Segalman
Shalom Segalman
1 year ago

Thank you this very same article.

Maybe just maybe instead of screaming anti semitism for the hundredth time (since by now its been overused so much nobody cares) and vowing to fight a lost cause — the yeshivos actually make an effort to teach our children some useful life skills to operate in this world?

Why does everyone have to struggle with b”h a large family and inflation from a 6th grade education. Why?

Maybe the oilam‘s reaction to everything should be some self reflection first, then decide if more action is needed.

statistics
statistics
1 year ago

“Last I checked 99 percent of my school is still part of our community, functioning properly, BH.”
Umm… you do realize that the ones never accepted to begin with. Would alter your 99 percent number.
as to his claim of one third check 2020 pew
“67% of Americans raised as Orthodox Jews by religion continue to identify with Orthodoxy as adults.”

Moishe
Moishe
1 year ago

“as the NYT article elaborates on the horrifying reality of violence against kids in our Yeshivos, where is our communal outrage” so you’re just like the rest of them that bought this bologna, what communal outrage? what are you talking about? no one knows of such things,and if it happened once you don’t need a communal outrage.

Last edited 1 year ago by Moishe
Sol L
Sol L
1 year ago

Rabbi? Maybe, stop mixing apples and oranges!

Wako
Wako
1 year ago

And where are you rabbi poupko speaking of against the state regulations??? You are no where to be found!! We only hear from you regarding us that we should’ve done more for this and that. Maybe write sn article with the same hate against the goyim!

ruby
ruby
1 year ago

this article is worse than the ny times one; so full of lies, exaggerations & real ignorance
just to name a few

  1. about getting kids in to schools , painful but to say that askanim , relatives, principals , board members have not been working on it CONSTANTLY- is ignorance , the process is complex there has to be some sort of admissions process..and in the end it works out for 95%

2 parshas reb shaul is an internal issue which most frum yidden have little
understanding of the inner workings of an empire of 15000 frum families , they are big enough to take care of themselves and ALL the shaul alter girls in america are IN frum schools

3 ” cant fit the mold” another myth , there are a few hundred mosdos in the tri state , the differences in level of learning & frumkeit are vast and in many shades.. is novominsk & waterberry the SAME mold? how about ohr yitzchok & riverdale..rabbi zucker similar to patterson..eatentown.. those are extreme but there is everything in between , the fact is many sincere people tried the half day yeshiva , half day work route few wanted to go ( may i remind you that the tzadik rav trenk , his yeshiva in lakewood couldnt get a minyan of boys & he was a genuine tzadik

Cohen
Cohen
1 year ago

It makes my blood boil seeing how the Aguda claims to be the one that fights and advocates for our Torah values and education when the people heading the Aguda especially in Erets Yisroel are the ones that are doing anything in their power in which ever kid, his or her parents goes to learn Torah and get inspired by the great gaon and fiery yiras shamayim Harav Shaul Alter Shlita should be denied a Torah education.

They cut funds and will do all sorts of unimaginable problems for any Yeshiva or School who dears to accept any of those kids.

I know this first hand from the administrators complaining to me and telling me what they are going through.

As we approach the yimei hadin who doesn’t remember the famous cry from Rabbi Reich that the mere fact that there is an organization in klal Yisroel called Yasfeini is a stain on the whole of Klal Yisroel.

What a kitrug hashem yerachem.

There is a shiur from harav Shafran the Rosh Yeshiva of Yehivas Pnei Menachem and famous dayan and renowned Posek from Bnei Brak, after the atrocities of Shabbos parshas Bechukosei, that it is a chiyuv for whoever could do anything has to do whatever could be done and whoever can’t do has the chiyuv to daven and say tehilim that people like this should loose whatever power they have, as did Dovid hamelech in perek 59 in tehilim, the Rav goes on explaining the chiyuv is based on the lav
Of לא תעמוד על דם רעך that if the only thing to do is to daven than this is the chiyuv

Dr Doomshtein
Dr Doomshtein
1 year ago

Where was Rabbi Poupko when Rabbi Goldschmidt Was unceremoniously fired from Park East Synagogue Because Rabbi Schneir had his ego pricked? Why didn’t he stand up and defend Rabbi G., instead taking away bread from the mouth of his children?

I like this game…

yankel
yankel
1 year ago

excusr rabbi, one has nothing to d0 with the.
you come with the ‘red herring’tayne

hard at work yeshiva grad
hard at work yeshiva grad
1 year ago

as usual he speaks in absolutes and broad negative attacks that may have some smidgen of emes to them, but he is so over the top that hard to take him seriously
there are askanim in lkwd who do help, look we all know it’s a probelm, but to say no one helps is a lie
ppl have spoken out that Rebbeim should stop hitting and even in most chsidic places its rarely done, ask anyone who is not an otd liar
where in the world does he get the figure that one third in our communities go off- maybe in real modern places where they barely have any connection but it’s not that by us
most ppl doesn’t have much pull in Gerer or Israeli mosdos that supposedly reject SEfradim to get involved in their politics
there are orgs that deal with kids who can’t make the cut-prob more should be done but we all know tons of tzadikim who are busy yomam velayla with the.
seriously, do you complain just to get attention or do you really research any of the things you write about?
be well, shanah tovah

Josh
Josh
1 year ago

He might be correct on lots of those issues, but things are not always perfect in any society. This law undermines the complete Torah system and hampers our core values. So What exactly is he saying here ???
If there are problems in the community that are not clear cut or perfect BECAUSE of that we shouldn’t fight this law together since on this we all agree!

Ron
Ron
1 year ago

Somehow it’s the democrats and their lobbyists defending the NYT

mmmjm
mmmjm
1 year ago

I have persoy seen these askonim working on the issues you mentioned…all of them. They have the time to do it because they are not sitting in front of a computer screen criticizing the community from a high horse….

Anonymous
Anonymous
1 year ago

Would be a good idea for someone to open a school in Lakewood for all the kids NOT having been accepted into Lakewood yeshivas !!!

SamEiger
SamEiger
1 year ago

I am not sure where Rabbi Poupko gets his “facts”. The Vaad in Lakewood works tirelessly to ensure that all children get placed into a school. A few years ago all of the Lakewood girls high schools were ordered not to open until the remaining girls were placed.

Don't have to take mussar from this attention seek
Don't have to take mussar from this attention seek
1 year ago

I’m sorry but we’re the heck does this MO guy who teaches in a very MO school, 6th -8th grades, have this audacity come across with this hypocrisy? If you look at who he is, his resume reads like chazir fis. Here here here, look at my feet I must be kosher.

I guess everything’s hunky-dory in the MO world. By the way Rabbi, how’s that the university of yours doing? Seems lately the government is trying to get involved over there as well. Now granted, I hope that they are able to win in the Supreme Court however, they made their own bed by going away from Torah values and trying to be like the Goyim.

How many kids in your MO schools were they teach the shtusim They do full off the path? The thing is you don’t realize that they fell off the pan because they’re already beginning behind the eight ball. I would love to see what the stats are for MO kids some two, three, or even four generations later. They’re definitely not MO. They probably drop the modern and are simply Orthodox – frum Shomer Torah u’mitzvos, or they are nebach out of the fold.

Bottom line is, check your own backyard before you check ours.

Say the truth
Say the truth
1 year ago

“Rabbi” where were YOU to help with the problems that you mentioned?

Iggeeyf
Iggeeyf
1 year ago

SHAYCHIS?? Double standard?? Hu? Like let’s find a way to bash yidden!

Susan
Susan
1 year ago

I find it interesting that you don’t mention most institutions by name but somehow don’t have a problem specifically singling out Ger twice in the article. Worse than the NYT are frum people who spew hatred on to their own people. Shame on you for being mekatrig before Rosh Hashana.

tweety
tweety
1 year ago

next time just post an article with the headline, “rabbi poupko breathed today,”
and let us see all the wonderful comments

The_Truth
Noble Member
The_Truth
1 year ago

Dear Rabbi Pupko,
Since you are an esteemed member of the executive committee of the Rabbinical Council of America, and an eleventh-generation rabbi, teacher and author, it would only seem fit that you are the right person to lead us out of this. There is no more relying on others to do this important work of the Klal, the time is now to act.

kiddush MACALLAN macher
kiddush MACALLAN macher
1 year ago

what a bunch of sheker hypocrites, a few years ago famed askan LA RECHNITZ HE BLASTED LAKEWOOD STYLE and everyone T.L HIM A HERO and nebech this rabbi poupko is labeled a HATER ?

Avrohom Eliezet from BP
Avrohom Eliezet from BP
1 year ago

It is a good idea they cant get into these schools – read the New York Times story.

Say the truth
Say the truth
1 year ago

In the community of this “Rabbi” only one third goes off the Derech? – That’s a miracle.
Stop mixing apples and cucumbers. Stick to the issue at hand.
The Chofetz Chaim’s yahrtzeit is next week – in honor of his yahrtzeit, please do teshuva for your loshon horah and motzee shem rah.

Steve
Steve
1 year ago

I always love it when people make up statistics
I can do it too
98.3% of the time when people quote an unsubstantiated statistic it completely undercuts the point they are trying to make
see, it’s easy!
maybe in the MO community 1/3 goes off the derech but I would love to know how our own 2 eyes are deceiving us when we see otherwise in our communities

The Author Exposed Himself
The Author Exposed Himself
1 year ago

“What-aboutism” is a common tactic used by leftists. For instance if you criticize Biden, they’ll say “but what about Trump he was an xyz”
The Mishna in Avos instructs us “שׁוֹאֵל כָּעִנְיָן וּמֵשִׁיב כַּהֲלָכָה, וְאוֹמֵר עַל רִאשׁוֹן רִאשׁוֹן וְעַל אַחֲרוֹן אַחֲרוֹן”
And it should be plainly obvious. That when yidden are being attacked, this is the time to defend them, NOT to find (or manufacture) new challenges against the community.
And to the author. This is now personal. You could have wrote your entire piece without mentioning names. But by naming R’ M’ Rubashkin personally, or specifically his children (in Chodesh Elul!), you exposed yourself. You exposed yourself to personal criticism because you got personal. And exposed yourself as having a biased opinion against fine Jews and your exposed yourself as buying the years of liberal media hyperbole (not unlike this NYT hit piece) that got Rubashkin arrested to begin with.
יהודים! אלול הגיע! חיזרו בתשובה

D. Fault
D. Fault
1 year ago

What junk piece! Why Vinnews published it is beyond me.
Here is one example of many misleading innuendos in this article.
“the fact that one-third (!!!) of the people who grow up frum end up leaving our communities”. That is a problem in the Modern Orthodox community. Actually there the real number may be closer to 50%.

Pinter
Pinter
1 year ago

Where are you all these years not doing anything to help the parents? Why didn’t you open your own yeshivah to accept all the ones who got rejected?????????

Yaakov Doe
Yaakov Doe
1 year ago

With our shuls and communities growing I find it hard to believe that one-third (!!!) of the people who grow up frum end up leaving our communities

triumphinwhitehouse
triumphinwhitehouse
1 year ago

cant disagree with him when he attacks fakewood and Aguda for facilitating having those Ger girls kicked out. BUT he is woke and a liberal and therefore is part of the problem.

Yawn
Yawn
1 year ago

Poupko is back with his anti religious propaganda cloaked in ulterior motives, we have all seen his shpiel before.

מה עניין שמיטה אצל הר סיני
מה עניין שמיטה אצל הר סיני
1 year ago

No one is interested in helping me when my wife burned the soup.
Also yesterday my sons school completed the building fund but the menahel hamosad is not building yet!
WINE O WINE!
Rabbi it seems your typewriter could not produce so you just sent a MS DOS command <just send anything.
Nice try! Wish you better success next time!

Last edited 1 year ago by diemaynstazdiebiztklieg
A yid
A yid
1 year ago

The rabbi has some good points that do need to be addressed. However this is a gezeoiras shmad literally. Did you take a look at what’s mandated curriculum in public schools recently?

Azoi
Azoi
1 year ago

Yea if my community would have such a ‘rabbi’ probably a third would leave

Judith
Judith
1 year ago

You can’t argue with him about his point on corporal punishment .

Jackson
Jackson
1 year ago

Personal question for Rabbi Poupko: How do I apply for this utopian school of yours or enter this utopian world of yours ? Or is that something you are expecting others to create while you are at the keyboard?