After Consulting With Gedolim, Israeli Poskim Retract Leniency On Shabbos Elevators

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JERUSALEM (VINnews) — A number of senior Poskim in Israel recently gave a heter to use a certain kind of Shabbos elevator, paving the way for the possible building of taller buildings in Bnei Brak and other chareidi communities desperately short of available land. However in the wake of a letter by Bnei Brak rabbi Shevach Tzvi Rosenblat prohibiting the use of such elevators, and after the Gedolim Rabbi Gershon Eselstein and Rabbi Dov Landau expressed their opinion against using such elevators, the poskim who had expressed the leniency retracted their opinions.

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Yated Neeman article permitting new Shabbos elevators

Rabbi Rosenblatt is also the rabbi of the Ahisamach neighborhood in Lod and was asked by the residents if they could rely on the new shabbos elevators, which use technologies that could make them more amenable for halachic use. Some residents have even purchased apartments in 10-story buildings based on this leniency. However Rabbi Rosenblatt, in keeping with the view of the Shevet Halevi Rabbi Shmuel Wozner, ruled that even if they are halachically permissible, such elevators should not be used by Bnei Torah as they “cause a degradation of Shabbos.”

After Rabbi Rosenblatt issued his ruling, the poskim who had granted the leniency, Rabbi Yitzchak Mordechai Rubin and Rabbi Sholom Gelber (co-authors of the Orchos Shabbos series) decided to present their ruling to Rabbi Gershon Edelstein shlita and Rabbi Dov Landau shlita.

The two Gedolim both ruled that even if there was a way to make a kosher Shabbos elevator, since the matter is complicated and there are new problems surfacing all the time. Due to this they ruled that shabbos elevators should not be used, and Rabbis Rubin and Gelber retracted their leniency.


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131 Comments
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Wilbur
Wilbur
10 months ago

If someone who is in need of a wheel chair or, possibly b”h still able to walk albeit stairs are painful due to arthritic needs or even worse, in need of hip or knee replacement, why can’t one understand that he or she needs it and if a heter can be found, it should be! Why are we so, so excited that these people may e homebound because of this p’saak. If there are differences in how the various elevators operate, let those problematic one be prohibited and the others remain okay! And we could add a stipulation that it should only be used when necessary.

Educated Archy
Educated Archy
10 months ago

am not learned enough to know the Halacha here . But if it’s truly really assur then bh it’s ending this way. However in the modern day era we seek the thrive of banning everything. And if anyone ever presents a heter to something that a hot head thinks should be banned (often not even based on Halacha rather just emotions) then he will make every gadol crazy till they ban it all. The days where the rav would spend all night trying to be a machsir a chicken slaughtered with a shaila, lest the poor chicken owner lose money, are gone . There are no longer attempts to find heterim.
I don’t know the case here but this is a broad problem and I hope this isn’t the issue here

Last edited 10 months ago by
Mr. Cohen
Mr. Cohen
10 months ago

This new chumrah is guaranteed to drive Jews away from mitzvah observance completely, especially Baalei Teshuvah and Geirim, and all those who struggle with mitzvah observance.

Liam K. Nuj
Liam K. Nuj
10 months ago

I was always under the impression that a Shabbos elevator may only be used by the elderly and infirm, not the general public. What was supposedly different about this particular elevator?

Moishe
Moishe
10 months ago

So basically it is halachakly mutar, the gedolim are just afraid that being a lenient on this might lead to other things, but no one ever said that there is halachakly any problems, so in the name of halacha everyone may do as his own posek or rav paskens, that is what halach demands from you to do, now since every single posek says that it is permitted halachakly hence it is permitted for every single Jew, only those that follow their hashkafa according to those gedolim they are not allowed to use it but remember only on the grounds of hashkafa not halacha.

Mitnachel
Mitnachel
10 months ago

This is a simple physics question. Does the motor use additional electricity if there are more people in the elevator or not? Should be easily solved with an amp meter. Can’t figure out why this is so hard. Even if it does not use constant draw, it is not difficult to design a circuit that uses constant power if I recall my electrical engineering days correctly.

A concerned person
A concerned person
10 months ago

Does anyone know truthfully how this elevator works that it can be used on shabbos? Some family members were recently on a very high floor in Jerusalem and were told that the elevator there is accepted by all chareidi rabbis…

Chill
Chill
10 months ago

Halachically permissible! Better not to use.sounds like the Eiruv!
Carrying daled amos is a maaseh. Standing in an elevator is no different than staying in the room with air condition! The machine is doing everything therefore it is muttar. HALACHA IS HALACHA.
SO LONG AS THE MACHINE WAS SET BEFORE SHABBOS!

Judith
Judith
10 months ago

I guess secular people can buy or rent some top floor apartments now at a very good price .

Holy Moe
Holy Moe
10 months ago

Carrying in the BoroPark eruv is much worse.

LKWD RABBI
LKWD RABBI
10 months ago

The news here is that the Gedolim are telling the Poskim how to Poskin.
Regardless of the Halachik discussion, THAT is what is groundbreaking here.

Alta Bubby
Alta Bubby
10 months ago

I feel very bad at such a ruling .get the problems ironed out with Halachic use of Shabbos elevator.
How does it cause a degradation of Shabbos by using a Shabbos elevator?
If someone is healthy and can do the steps, even ten floors, fine..But I can’t.
Shabbos is being degraded by forcing people to stay inside, not go to Shul even, since the Shabbos Elevator can’t be used.
What about mothers with babies in strollers?
What’s with u?
If u want to be makpid on yourself, fine!
But not on others

Josè
Josè
10 months ago

Machmir ober nish dir!

Jack
Jack
10 months ago

Oy,this is exactly why we miss Reb Moishe Feinstein obm.
If it’s halachikli permissible to use Shabbos elevators, why would these Rabbonim make old and sick people climb the steps to fourth or fifth floors

Ben Torah
Ben Torah
10 months ago

The oilam should take a look at teshuvos vhanhagos Chelek 1 Siman 216

DOSH
DOSH
10 months ago

Regarding special halochos applicable to hospital patients or visitors,
see sefer Hospitals in Halacha, published by Feldheim and available in most Judaica stores.
It addresses all questions and issues arising in a hospital setting including those regarding elevators and all automatic, sensor activated, lights, toilets and sinks, etc.
Also available at http://www.hospitalsinhalacha.org/

Marcia
Marcia
10 months ago

We lived on the 13th floor of a building which was lucky. My father was ill so he took the elevator on Shabbos but walked the stairs on Yom Kipper when it fell out on Shabbos. He is gone now and I guarantee tee you, he is with Hashem.

Kvetch
Kvetch
10 months ago

I’ve been up and down on this, getting off now at 121

Kvetch
Kvetch
10 months ago

I’m on a low b4 I read this but end up on a high. Sometimes the other way around.

Avigdor Miller
Avigdor Miller
10 months ago

Rebbunim are simply scared and can’t think for themselves.

Sholom
Sholom
10 months ago

Nobody knows how this elevator works.
It’s a total mystery, like ma’aseh Bereishis.

The engineers who designed it don’t know, the people who maintain them don’t know, the people who constructed them don’t know, the Rabbonim that have studied the issue extensively and been involved in every aspect of the design don’t know. Don’t let the fact that they’ve written detailed psakim and detailed seforim fool you.

Somehow these elevators just appeared in certain buildings and no one in the world knows how they got into those buildings, let alone onto our planet.

And, as the Rabbonim have written here, these elevators are like some kind of biological organism that can evolve on their own into something even more unknowable. And they’re changing (on their own!!) EVERY SINGLE DAY!

Scary!!

Musmuch
Musmuch
10 months ago

Being Machmir brings a Kaparah to the person & Klal Yisroel & brings Moshiach closer.
When I was in a remote part of America & couldn’t find formula my Ruv said it was better to feed my infant (pure with a hashgacha) juice or water rather than non-cholov Yisroel milk.

Triumphinwhitehouse
Triumphinwhitehouse
10 months ago

Good there is no heter