Why Dr. Sokol’s Study May Be Fundamentally Flawed in Regard to the Yeshiva Community

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By Rabbi Yair Hoffman for 5tjt.com

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In the November 18th, 2022 edition of the Journal for the Scientific Study of Religion (https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/jssr.12812), a study was published by Dr. Yosef Sokol, Naomi Rosenbach,Chayim Rosensweig,Chynna Levin,Shifra Hubner, and Isaac Schechter entitled, “Examining Average Age at First Marriage within Orthodox Judaism: A Large Community-Based Study.”  The research has been lauded as debunking “the supposed surplus of eligible women in relation to eligible men.”

Firstly, before we get into the questions on Dr.  Sokol’s data collection and methodologies, I just want to state that I believe Dr. Sokol is a remarkable individual who is a true Ben Torah with exemplary midos.  He is community minded, means well, and seriously wants to help by using his formidable skills and training to help the observant Torah community.  In general, I found the study to be impressive in regard to the general Modern Orthodox Jewish community.  I believe, however, that his study and his reported findings may be fundamentally inaccurate – specifically regarding the Yeshiva and Bais Yaakov communities.

In the first articles that were released about the study, it was reported that 5000 out of a total of 9000 respondents were self-identified family members of the Yeshiva community.  In this author’s opinion, many readers took this study to mean that Dr. Sokol feels that there is no Shidduch crisis.  This is a problem because it undermines the efforts of some very good people who have dedicated themselves to resolving the underlying situation.

Both data collection and the science of conducting studies are not my areas of expertise, but this does not mean that we cannot explore and question.  I did interview Dr. Sokol and presented my questions on his methodology and data collection.

FIRST OBSERVATION

Firstly, the categories that were used in the self-identification section the study might be misleading and may perhaps be given to very serious error.   The categories he used in his study were:

  • 1 Yeshiva Orthodox
  • 2 Modern Orthodox
  • 3 Hasidic
  • 4 Chabad
  • 5 non-Orthodox

I humbly suggest that if one were to Google both the term, “Yeshivish” (549,000 hits) and the term “Yeshiva Orthodox” (1230 hits) that person would conclude that “Yeshiva Orthodox” can be a very misleading term. And most, if not all of those “Yeshiva Orthodox” are not reflective of the actual term.  Essentially, the term Yeshiva Orthodox does not exist.  Thus, those who responded with a self-identification in the first category may have felt that choice #1 includes both the category of “Yeshivesh” and the category of “Orthodox” as opposed to the non-existent “Yeshiva Orthodox” as a category.

In other words, it may have been read as Yeshiva or orthodox, two different categories that stand to the right of Modern Orthodox.

SECOND OBSERVATION

The second observation is that if I were to have conducted this study, I would preferred to have analyzed the specific data as it comes from each of the Yeshiva community schools or Bais Yaakovs.  How many of the class of 2010 Bais Yaakov X are married?  Why go through the indirect method of internet surveys discussing other members of the family?  When I posed this question, Dr. Sokol responded, “That was the very first thing that I tried to do.  The Bais Yaakovs, however, did not agree to give over their class lists and therefore developed alternative methods of finding the data.”  It is clear that Dr. Sokol does admit that the data collection was not ideal.  The study itself states (p. 714): ..this study utilized a nonrandomized method of sampling: a crowdsourcing/convenience sampling technique.  The reason that was given was that “there is no standard and available method of random sampling in the Orthodox Jewish community in North America, nor a relevant database from which to conduct random sampling.”

THE THIRD OBSERVATION

The third observation is that the study states (p. 715) that the survey was distributed and publicized online through paid email advertisements, social media forums, texting platforms, word of mouth, web-based community news forums, and emails from Orthodox Jewish clergy leadership organizations (e.g., Rabbinical Council of America) to their members and affiliated Orthodox Jewish communities.

It is this author’s view, however, that a not insignificant percentage of the Yeshivish Torah community do not visit internet websites or WhatsApp ( even if it is just one member of their family), and the data may be unreflective of the actual situation on the ground.  When we combine this with the first observation, the results can be skewed even more.

THE FOURTH OBSERVATION

The fourth observation is that those who have studied the issue of the Female Shidduch Crisis in the Yeshiva/Bais Yaakov communities are well aware that it is not merely anecdotal.  It is based upon empirical analyses of data that come from schools.  Also, the fact that there is a larger pool of girls because of earlier dating norms is a reality.  These norms do not exist in the Chassidish communities, nor in more modern communities nor in Eretz Yisroel. In response to this point Dr. Sokol explained that those who have studied this issue have not studied whether the same norm exists in the Yeshivos for men. Dr. Sokol claims that the data from the schools does not extend to age 40.

Dr. Sokol disagreed with each of the four observations.  He claimed that the data from the schools up to 30 year-olds is almost identical to what he had found.  His data states that is that when the Yeshiva Orthodox are in their 30’s – another 6 percent of girls do get married, bringing the total Yeshiva Orthodox by age 40 to 96%.

THE PLUS SIDE

It could be that the aforementioned observations are incorrect, as it is not my area of expertise. However, I would like to note that shadchanim, mothers of boys and girls, and the numerous older girls that I have encountered – point to the reality of this crisis.  The response to this is that all of it is anecdotal.  So what is the plus side?  It could be that Dr. Sokol’s study will give further hope to those who have given up, and encourage them to strengthen their efforts in both hishtadlus and Tefillos to find their bashert.  At the same time, we must strengthen our efforts in trying somehow to minimize the age gap which is making a difficult situation significantly worse.  And to this, both Dr. Sokol and those who question the methodology both agree.

Dr. Sokol responded,  “There is definitely a communal problem of women not getting married when they want to. One take-home message here is that if almost all young men are getting married quickly and a large percentage of young women never get married that presents certain necessary solutions. However, the study showed that both men and women are having trouble getting married right away, and the vast majority of both end up getting married – though some much later than they want. This presents a different communal problem with a different set of solutions. Our community can explore new ways to help these young women (and men) who are struggling to get married.

CONCLUSION

It is this author’s opinion that contrary to Dr. Sokol’s view, the four observations do have validity and that the vast majority of women who do end up eventually marrying which Dr. Sokol references is still 2% less than his statistics of men who are married (98%).  Dr. Sokol’s figure of 96% may, unfortunately. be higher than the true number on account of the four observations.  It is also likely that reducing the dating age gap will result in more of our young women getting married – and this is a conclusion that Dr. Sokol, unfortunately, disagrees with. Perhaps a thought experiment may be employed to explain why it would be true.  What if the age gap was, say 30 years, instead of 4 years?  Would Dr. Sokol agree that, in theory, that this age gap would cause more women not to be married?  It is unlikely that he would disagree.  If so, at what point does it stop?

One last thought:  There is no question that even according to Dr. Sokol’s numbers the extra 60 percent longer in time that it takes our young ladies to get married over the time men take is something that we should be addressing.

 

The author can be reached at [email protected]

 

 

 

 

 


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38 Comments
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Can't cheat the math
Can't cheat the math
1 year ago

Here is the math; there are 3 variables; these formulas are approximations that work only if the variables below did not change over the average life expectancy or last 3 to 4 generations:

A)ratio of boys over girls of the same age(usually there are about 5% more boys than girls born each year)
B)children born to an average woman in her lifetime
C)average of all women’s ages at birth

Annual population growth % = (B/2)^(1/C)-1
in excel=POWER(B/2,1/C)-1

Age difference in years to pair up all boys and girls = log_((B/2)^(1/C))(A)
in excel=LOG(A,POWER(B/2,1/C))

Example: if A=1.05, B=6, C=30, then:
Annual population growth % = (6/2)^(1/30)-1 = 3.73%
Age difference in years to pair up all boys and girls = log_((6/2)^(1/30))(A) = 1.33
That means that, in this example, in order to pair all, boys have to be 1 year and 4 months older than girls on average.

If B=8, then the optimal age difference calculates to just about a year.

Obviously, all shiduchim are by H, just as everything else in the world. However, if you outfit a Titanic with enough lifeboats for only 85% of the population, bederech hatevah, which happens to be how H ensures free will in this world, 15% of the people on the boat are guarantied not to survive. You can’t cheat the arithmetic. Provide life boats for everyone and let H do hidden nissim bederech hatevah.

Define the terminology
Define the terminology
1 year ago

Actually, you can have different types of “yeshivish” communities. You can have 2 years in beis medrash and then get married. Or you can have a community where it’s expected 2 years in beis medrash in the US plus another 2 years in EY plus another year in Lakewood before you start dating. The later type are the ones that leave 15-20% of their girls without a mathematical possibility of getting married at a childbearing age.

Rrr
Rrr
1 year ago

Even if they get married over time they will have less children. Somone who marries at 27 compared to 24 or to 20. Its a bad situation

Hasidic shidduch crisis
Hasidic shidduch crisis
1 year ago

What is R. Hoffman doing for the Chasidishe shiduch crisis?

A yid
A yid
1 year ago

It is interesting that in the chasidic communities where they generally marry younger, the boys are having a harder time. I wonder why that is.

Shechinabegalusa
Shechinabegalusa
1 year ago

R yair, thanks for the bravery in addressing this painful topic! It’s high time for us as a as community to do something about this, we must create viable options for boys to be able to come back from eretz yisroel without being held hostage in the freezer!!! Just think about it, let’s say there are 1500 “yeshivish” type girls looking for a shidduch this coming pesach time – if the boys aren’t locked up when they come home for pesach these girls stand a chance but if they’re held hostage until the summer there’s another 1000 seminary girls in the pool for same amount of boys

Robert
Robert
1 year ago

I don’t know if this is wishful thinking but BMG has a tremendous amount of data, and so do the Seminaries as well. Helevai if we can get that data….

Meir Okay
Meir Okay
1 year ago

It is obvious to anyone who has eyes or a heart that there is an age gap causing a lot of singles in the Litvish Yeshiva world. When a Litvish boy is in Shidduchim the phone will ring off the hook south Shidduchim. When a Litvish girl is looking for a Shidduch it is difficult to get a date. This is an unfortunate phenomenon that is occurring to so many Litvish girls in the USA (not Israel). It is obvious that Dr. Sokol didn’t do his study in Lakewood N.J. Or any of the out of town Litvish communities. He should have specified that his study is for the Modern Orthodox who don’t have a Shidduch crises as there is no age gap by them and they don’t have an age gap of 24 year old boys going out with 19 year old girls. The modern orthodox don’t send their children to BMG which puts an unexplained FREEZER in place for half a year against the repeated pleas of the Gedolim of Eretz Yisrael who have ruled that it is prohibited and against Halacha to force a 24 year old incoming Bochur to wait half a year so he can “acclimate” to BMG (and be eligible for their PELL grants).

Baruch Shor
Baruch Shor
1 year ago

Shorter Hoffman:

“This study disputes what I believe to be true, so it has to be flawed”

Blue
Blue
1 year ago

The first “Observation” is absurd & seems like nit picking because you don’t like his results. Anyone mentally capable of getting married would understand the meaning of “Yeshiva Orthodox” after hearing the other choices of “Modern Orthodox” “Chasidic” “Chabad” etc. To claim respondents understood that as Yeshivish OR Orthodox show very little respect for them.

Potato head
Potato head
1 year ago

Simple question
If every marriage is a male and female how can their numbers be different

Avi
Avi
1 year ago

The entire Shidduch crisis isn’t that complicated. Most girls want something very specific as do most boys. This is not like outside the frum community where people are more open to a wider pool of girls. Therefor every mishigas gets in the way for people. Even the girls that don’t get a date can get one by someone they don’t want to go out with. For example a working ben Torah. I’m not saying it’s wrong but I believe it is fact.
Chasidim are different in this regard.

Shmuff
Shmuff
1 year ago

The larger question is, why was Dr. Sokol the first to examine the data? A hypothesis should be formed based on a close review of the data. Instead, we have organizations, as well as the author, that push solutions to problems they don’t fully understand based on empirical statistics. Imagine how much unnecessary hardship or harm may have been caused by age gap reduction programs, if Dr. Sokol is right.

Azoi
Azoi
1 year ago

How about all girls go to college/work and refuse to date until aged 24-25 like the boys, that will fix the discrepancy and give our community leaders and boys something to think about. Lehoir, half the girls out there davka want a boy two years older and look down at boys their own age…

Triumphinwhitehouse
Triumphinwhitehouse
1 year ago

Age gap theory has been debunked

TJ Max
TJ Max
1 year ago

Kudos to Rabbi Hoffman for being so brave and always helping the underdog and those who do not have a forum to articulate their pain and suffering. The Halachic authorities spent sleepless nights to permit one Agunah. Unfortunately there are thousands of Litvish Agunos out there. The younger Rosh Yeshivos by the Litvaks don’t send their students to Israel till they are 22……. This is a travesty. Most boys want to spend two years in Israel….. When they come back to the USA due to financial reasons, the largest Yeshivah in America makes the Bochurim wait another six months. This Freezer was put in place 25 years ago by the Yeshivah with not all of the Roshei Yeshivos there agreeing to at (as all Israeli Gedolim have prohibited it). Unfortunately we as a community cannot get together and make real changes to help the Bnos Yisroel out. How many more single girls will have to suffer before people start realizing that in the last 25 years we made some serious systematic mistakes that are hurting so many of our precious girls.

whowhatand WHY?
whowhatand WHY?
1 year ago

As Rabbi H points out there really is no such thing as Yeshiva Orthodox !! Its entirely possible that people in the right wing Modern Orthodox category might be the people who self identified in the study as Yeshiva (University) Orthodox although they probably usually self identify as Modern Orthodox Machmir… but if that wasn’t a category to choose from and they had to choose between the categories on that list it could go either way. I wonder what percentage of people who responded “Yeshiva Orthodox” are actually Yeshivish as defined by most of the people in Lakewood or Monsey. May be close to zero. That group is certainly less likely to be on the internet and answering these surveys in the first place. One thing is for sure – as someone who reads many many shidduch resumes from all across the observance spectrum I don’t think I’ve ever seen an obviously Yeshivish person self identify as “Yeshiva Orthodox”. Why in the world did the authors of this study choose to use that term?!?

And another big problem with the survey – how many people switch groups? I personally know many people who grew up Yeshivish but as they got older and remained single started to identify more as Modern Orthodox Machmir (or in some cases Modern Orthodox without the Machmir and in some cases as no longer Orthodox) Which category would a formerly Yeshivish woman who slowly became another category and finally married at 40 have properly responded in?