Rockland County, NY – Tensions are again running high in the East Ramapo School District after police were summoned to the Grandview Elementary School in Monsey today to respond to complaints of trespassing by Orthodox Jewish families.
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Newsday reports (http://bit.ly/OCd4t2) that local parents say they are justifiably concerned about Jewish strangers accessing the public school and using it as a shortcut to their homes or synagogues during the Jewish holidays. Today marked the first time security guards and parent volunteers were stationed at the school to prevent families from cutting through the premises. Security will be in place for the remainder of the Sukkot holiday.
“My number one concern is the children’s safety outside when they’re at recess,” said Grandview Principal Patricia Smith. “It is a concern when our children are outside and having people other than the school personnel being outside. In this day and age, when we don’t know who’s who, it worries me.”
Ignoring the “no trespassing” sign posted in front of the school, religious Jews continued to cross the playground, resulting in a shouting match between the guards and members of the Jewish community. “At the end of the day, there’s no trespassing,” said Cassandra Edwards, a parent volunteer. “You can walk to the front of the building and you can read it. If it says no trespassing, then all we want is for people to respect that.”
But Esti Grossberger defended use of the shortcut, saying it shortened the walk between her and her parents’ home by half. “They’re camping out and attacking us like wolves,” Grossberger said of the school district. “Why would you do this in the rain when you know we don’t drive on the holidays? Seriously? You’re not getting rid of the Jews.”
One parent volunteer said she was called an anti-Semite when she politely asked a group of Jews not to walk through the playground and to find a different route instead. As the argument between the guards and the religious Jews continued to escalate, police were called to the school and a report was taken. No arrests were made.
Security officers have also been posted at Lime Klin Elementary School in Suffern, Ramapo High School and Kakiat Middle School in Spring Valley, and Elmwood Elementary School in Monsey. Joel Klein, the East Ramapo School Superintendent said the district is working on a plan to resolve the trespassing issue, which may include putting up fencing and additional signage.
ITS PUBLIC PROPERTY
Both wrong/Both correct
If the school has an issue with what they call “tresspassers” they have a right to feel uncomfortable with people passing through school property-however, while people are walking through is NOT the time to deal with it. They should have gone about it legally beforehand, or put signs or roadblocks but stopping people dead in their tracks, amidst the rain was completely wrong on their part. I’m a frum Jew and chances are the people walking through were harmless, but if I were a parent in that school, I’d also want to know my kids are safe from ppl. walking through. But again, it should have been dealt with in another manner.
This is the problem, the first response is its antisemitic, you cannot be using this line every single time someone disagrees with you, or it wont mean a whole lot eventually
its a grand chillul hasm how can we enter property thats not ours…
were still in golus
Yes, the school administration is being petty and selfish (which is not surprising given the current climate over there), but… IT IS THEIR RIGHT!
After all, it IS indeed trespassing.
Achainu Bnei Yisroel, we need to comport ourselves politely, civilly and graciously!
I wonder how an orthodox Jewish school would react if the roles were reversed…
It’s not PULIC property, it’s SCHOOL property. There has to be security there, especially when school is in session. And by ignoring the school’s request just to save some time off their walk home from shul, they are causing a BIG CHILLUL HASHEM!! The school children’s safety has to be the number one priority for the school administration.
i dont live there but reading this it sounds like pure anti semitism..The community should with hold all property taxes to the schools that are like bigots,
Nope, public school property
Many frum Yidden need to learn how to be respectful even if someone has a different opinion even when it’s not connivance for us. Why don’t they just simply apologize and arrange a meeting with the principal. Make a kiddush Hashem and then the next time you’ll even be able to offer to bench lulav with them and they’ll happily say yes and then we’ll bring them back to Torah and Mitzvos. is this the way we talk to Hashem’s children or creatures with the arba minim in hand that are supposed to teach ahavas yisroel UNITY? sorry but this is disturbing.
It is legal under New York State law for residents to cross public school property.
This is so upsetting. Don’t we realize that we are in golus, and that it is taunting history, not to mention the directives of Chazal, not to step on the tail of the sleeping dog? It’s all well and good to claim equal rights as American citizens, and indeed we should do everything within our rights to defend ourselves, but it’s quite another thing to ignore sensitivities and run the risk of igniting tensions that are simmering just beneath the surface. Isn’t it worth going the long way around to prevent chilul Hashem?
What I’d really like to see is the property deeds, there would be no issue after that, one would be right and one would be wrong……
A chillul Hashem. Kids deserve protection and nobody should be walking on school grounds unless there is a reason pertaining to the school to do so.
why is miss peggy allowed to invite herself onto school property whenever she wants to trespass? And… if you watch the principal of the school in the video you will, you know, learn, you know, why the kids don’t, you know, learn in the ERSCD public schools.
Actually, it was discriminatory — and directed exclusively at Orthodox Jews.
Only pedestrians (Orthodox Jews) were stopped; drivers (not Orthodox) were not stopped, nor were they prevented from entering the grounds.
Could it be that trespassing has anything to do with skin color? Stand out there and watch the “trespassers” during a regular Monday Tuesday or any other day.
Guess nobody here reads the news that often. There is an ongoing fight between the board (which a majority of is jewish) and the public school system (obviously non jewish). Now if they really have the law with them, let them resolve it in court. This is just a byproduct of that dispute. By now we already know, here in the us its not whos right (according to law and even on constitutional law, but rather who makes more noise. (travon martin, anti muslim video etc. Proves this point.)
And if goyim were cutting through a yeshiva in Monroe, what would we say?
i’m living in that area for almost 10 years and i use that pass every shabbos & yomtov and never had a problame till yesterday. wether its tresspassing or not i don’t think that is the issue here . what my issue is if they dont want us to walk there (and they knew its being done for as long as jews lived in that area) then send out letters or call a community meeting before yomtov and work things out not to be coming home from shul in the pouring rain and be told ur tresspassing and now go another route that can take at least another 10 min to get home
If groups of goyim would trespass yeshiva properties and give the same excuses, the schools would be calling Shomrim and parents would say we don’t want goyim to walk among our kids. And Goyim should start coining a phrase “Gentile-phobia” to counter attack every-time antisemitism cries are made.
I understand that the security guard has a job to do.
But, does the school really have volunteer guards?
Can any citizen volunteer?
Any tax payer? (that would include haredim).
What is their authority? Whtch the children, the property, whatever they want to watch?
If they are unofficial guards then they are also trespassing.
Having a student in the school does not give parents carte-blanch to come on the school property for any reason.
If the parents were not signed in as visitors for the purpose of an officially sanctioned school volunteer patrol then they also should have been asked to leave.
Something tells me there is a real discrimination angle for selective enforcement by the school and it’s employees.
As a home-owner on a property adjacent to the school, I feel obligated to comment here. For all the uninformed people responding ‘chillul hashem’ and the like, you need to understand the situation. This particlar school has a path connecting Grandview ave to Van Winkle Rd which is a major corridor to neighborhoods within and beyond Wesley Hills. It is a paved path which was created to allow ease of travel particularly for walking pedestrians to reach that area. There are alternate walking routes through the maze of side streets which would add 20-25 minutes of walking time. On a typical Shabbos, there are many, many people (possibly hundreds) walking that path to and from shul and there has never been an incident. The students and faculty running the school are not from the area. All the students are bussed in from neighboring towns and villages such as Spring Valley. The school is part of the East Ramapo Central School District which has a school board. It is at the discretion of this school board to decide whether to allow people to cross the school property and until they create such a rule, it is 100% legal and legitimate to take that shortcut.
The group of people stationed at the entry ways to the shortcut were not police or school officials, rather ‘concerned parents’ who have reached out to the school board in the past in an attempt to halt these evil trespassers. The school board at the time had decided that it was a non issue and have therefore not placed any restrictions. And guess who 2 of the 6 so called ‘concerned parents’ were? None other than Keith Meyers -a registered sex offender (google) and Cassandra Edwards, with the NAACP (a known loudmouth) both of Spring Valley. I have overheard Edwards shouting at the Yidden passing by “hipocrits, where is your god now?” and other borderline anti-semitic comments. This particular incident was set up deliberately to create a scene so that their agenda can be reintroduced to the school board. The principals concern was about having people pass through the school yard during recess but it was pouring rain and there were no students outside at all. Given all these facts and the inconvenience caused to so many local yidden on their way home from shul makes me wonder …. who are the real trespassers?
They’re lucky they weren’t in Texas. Here we shoot first and ask questions later.
I assume this has been going on for years so why all of a sudden. I wouldn’t want strangers walking around in my kids school grounds.
Let them sit at a table and discuss the issue and resolve it. There has to be a solution to this. Even if in ends up costing a few extra $$$ for security.
Even a public school, has the right to restrict access to their property. How would the frum community feel, if people were walking through shul or yeshiva property even a playground as a shortcut to get to a mosque or a church? People would immediately be screaming, and citing child safety and other issues.
If they were so worried about the kids safety, let them stay there and watch the kids, people can still cut through, just watch the kids.
To add to my earlier comment (#2), after more thought, I realized, how eventhough it may have been unintentionally tresspassing, the fact of the matter is, that the guy whose “family was wiped out in Aushwitz” should have been more empathetic and compassionate. I mean to wear a microphone and accost frum ppl-his brothers– It’s like he couldn’t wait to use that line-I mean really-whose side is he on? Has he not learned anything from the Holocaust? On the other hand, the frum man who responded to him, shouldn’t have been so offensive, and could have offered to shake lulav with him, and invited him for a meal….. It’s no way to spend y”t shouting at people not to tresspass!
Under the circumstances, why can’t all these guards just make sure that pedestrians just keep walking without interacting with the children in any way?
Come on guys, “forgive us our trespasses.”
No Trespassing signs are up so they have the right to block .
Why are they enforcing it just this 2 days of October ?they do have a guard on the grounds whats their problem with safety ? Whats with this Volunteer how are they allowed on School Grounds ?
I’m afraid that the frum community in this instance, bit off more than they can chew. The parents and school administrators have every right, while the school is in session, to limit access to its grounds. The police should have shown some leadership, and explained to the Yidden that they must stay off school property, while school was in session. If this was a Yeshivah, the parents and administrators would not want gentiles or anybody else, to trespass on its grounds, while classes were in session. According to Halacha, it is imcumbent upon Jews to respect the laws of the countries which they live in. I’m afraid that in this case, they failed miserably!
It just makes me laugh and how dumb some people are.
We put up fences, lock gates and post security guards outside our educational institutions so why can’t they? If a few hundred goyim found it “convenient” to walk through the playground of your child’s school while your kids were out there playing, would you be OK with that? Of course not.
Schools must protect children. PERIOD.
These people do not have kids in the school.
These people do not have any business with the school.
These people have been told in the past that they are trespassing and signs were posted to reflect that.
It is one thing to cut through the yard when school is not in session and there is no danger to children, but to do it on days when school is in session and children are present is irresponsible and dangerous.
Personally, I think they should get the local police to stand there handing out trespassing notices next Monday, and then arrest those who trespass again on Tuesday. The SMART, respectful Jews will go around, and the idiots who insist on making one chillul H” after another will go to jail for trespassing all for their own stupidity. Seems fair to me!
Sad to say, but we don’t have the “right” to walk through any property without permission. Once, while out of town, I was told to walk through a certain house as a short cut. When I did this, a new young owner came out of her house and said we were walking through her property. WE WERE!!! I apologized and explained that I was not from the neighborhood and that this is where I was told to go through. She said she had told people many times that this was her private back yard and they could not use it. I asked her for directions around because I had no idea where I was going. I apologized to her. She was then very kind to me and told me I could use her cut through this one time only.
I felt awful. Yes, it was longer to get to the shul, and yes, everyone was used to walking through here, but one of the houses of the cut through had been sold and the new owner didn’t want her private and beautiful back yard to be a public walkway.
We are not allowed to bully our way through something like this. When people ask you in a reasonable way to walk around – we must respect that.
reply to # 42 actually there was a shule in this particular school about 4 years ago so this whole thing about tresspassing is a bunch of hog wash
to pmo in fl dont shoot ur mouth off if u dont know what ur talking about i pay a hell of a lot in taxes so these bussed in kids can go to school and no we were never told we cant pass through. and there is an official pass that they clear in the winter i guess .for us to pass
BRILLIANT tactical move! It proves, in the eyes or their antagonists, that the Orthodox aren’t even entitled to usage — if only to walk through. This, despite their paying taxes.
Chillul Hashem shouldn’t be confused with being assertive. Galus or not, frum families, as tax payers, are – to use an imprecise analogy – also part “owners” of that school lot. They have a right to use it if only for a few seconds as a short-cut.
Are they being disruptive? Are they attempting to “convert” anybody to a religious way of life? Are they doing this EVERY DAY? These are isolated incidents.
Common sense dictates “cultural sensitivity” just as those oh-so-enlightened educators would show others.
Those wonderful altruistic volunteers — and their school handlers — imply that there may be molesters among those walking-thru. Do they actually believe that Jews in distinctive dress are going to attempt something? And in the rain, natch — when the kiddies will be indoors? What an absolutely idiotic argument.
Having adult or even teen strangers hanging around a school yard is asking for trouble. But even those objecting admit that the Orthodox are merely passing through.
BRILLIANT tactical move! It proves that the frum aren’t entitled to
usage — even if only to walk through — despite paying taxes.
y dont schools deal with better things by just making an issue out of a tissue
The security guard is Jewish. The trespassor should not have called the guard an antisemite in front of the video crew. This guard is being paid to keep the kinder safe. How is this considered antisemitism?
Why don’t all you people screaming chillul hashem watch the news 12 video of the confrontation and then you tell me what you would do when these ”people” start screaming and blocking you like you’re killing someone.Also I have not seen a no trespassing sign in any of the news stations. I have seen a no loitering sign and loitering is defined as: the act of remaining in a particular public place for a protracted time.So no one is breaking any law here. There is also a path which is plowed by the town every winter which shows this is public property.And last but not least if they are so worried about the safety of their kids have one volunteer watch the kids and make sure no adults approach them. If they say they can’t get any volunteers just show them the videos where there are 3-4 people blocking one elderly woman.
“But Esti Grossberger defended use of the shortcut, saying it shortened the walk between her and her parents’ home by half. “They’re camping out and attacking us like wolves,” Grossberger said of the school district. ‘Why would you do this in the rain when you know we don’t drive on the holidays? Seriously? You’re not getting rid of the Jews.’
Great. How NOT to make friends and to influence people.
Esti – who was *not* content just to stick her nose in where it was unwanted (bad enough) then aggravatesd the already deteriorating situation by using insults and exaggerations (“They’re … attacking us like wolves”).
That day was not the first time ever that rain had fallen in Rockland County. Even if this Esti had not listened to the radio weather forecast on yomtov, if she had just looked up at the sky she would have seen that rain was imminent.
And by the way, Esti, no one was trying to “get rid of the Jews”. All they wanted is for YOU to stay off THEIR land. What, I wonder, would this Esti’s reaction if walkers took a short cut across her back yard because it was raining?
There are 20 child molestors living within 2 miles of that school. There are signs all over the area about not trespassing. This has NOTHING to do with antisemitism at all!!!! The laws say no trespassing whether you are going to Shul or just walking through looking to harass the kids. If a group of goyim kept walking through our Yeshivas and we had signs posted, we would complain also. Just because these are goyish kids attending public school, we still need to obey the laws.
It seems that pmoimfl is very intent on having jews locked up for minor infractions in fl and ny. Moser and rodef.
#70 is right. The volunteer parents were there at the principal’s invitation.
Therefore she should be held accountable for their actions.
I doubt raising a vigilanty parent melitia
Isn’t the arrival of a news agency or the police actions that require intervention and management by the district adminustration.
Was she authorized to speak to the press?
Are her statements an expression of district policy?
the school board needs to review her actions for corporate compliance and terminate her for the violations. She is acting way above her paygrade.
why don’t they lock up all the illegal immigrants for trespassing in to this country at the same token..
part of the reason taxes is so high in monsey is because the schools are filled with illegals who don’t pay a penny in taxes
The insensitivity and knee-jerk labels of “chilul Hashem” by many of the above posters are so hurtful. That together with blatant ignorance is plain mean. Let me assure you, we are not talking about any old “shortcut”. This is the main artery leading my neighborhood to other neighborhoods. Many of my neighbors along with my family have chosen our shul based on this path (which incidentally was a factor in buying my house). The public school property is huge, about 3-4acres. When the children are outside playing they would hardly be disturbed. Kal vchomer while they are in class?? They wouldn’t even see us! It was pouring rain on the day these activists chose to implement their plan. I began my walk with 3 children to my brother’s house for what should have been a 20 minute walk. I was caught off guard and yelled at by 3 women. I said please I have no other way to go, just let me pass, they began to curse me out and threatened to throw me into jail. My 5 year old daughter began to cry so I turned around and went the other way. It took me 55 minutes to get to my meal!! This was not OK. I invite any poster to come and see what this so- called shortcut looks like. Until then, kindly bite your tongue.
You stated your desire to have jews locked up to teach them a lesson.
moser and rodef.
In monsey it is not unusual to see people crossing through parking lots of shuls, mosdos chinich, fire departments and public schools. This was a drastic change from the status-quo with pre-arranged media presence for added effect.
It was RAINING. There were no kids playing outside.
This was only being done to show who’s boss.
The school knows if it was debated at the school board meeting,
blocking the Jews would stop immediately.