New York – We got on board because we were striving for truth, and guess what? We’re still striving! So please, make sure your seat belts stay fastened because we’re sitting beside you now, and we hope to take you right along with us!
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It was the most idealistic and dedicated who helped make us the people we have become. After deciding to be observant, however, we all inevitably realized that many frum people were not quite as purely committed as those who had initially inspired us. Varying degrees of disappointment and disillusionment are standard, but what happens after that is critical.
Witnessing “frum” people engage in corrupt behavior can be a deal-breaker for some, especially if the frum-appearing people wield authority in leadership positions. Unsavory business practices, the belittling of legitimate attempts at improvement, and “accepted” practices to cheat government agencies, can all lead to an earnest ba’al teshuva (returnee to observant Judaism) being understandably turned off.
There are prevailing fears related to “change” in Orthodox spheres, for justifiable reasons, but these same fears also prevent essential progress from taking place.
It can be difficult for the voice of a quiet ba’al teshuva with a well-honed refinement to be heard when an arrogant insensitivity prevails. When children in public school seem to have more derech eretz (respect) than those in many day schools, a need for reevaluation is indicated. Worries about reporting “frum” perpetrators who are dangerous to children are another example of how our fears have led to unnecessarily increased problems with disastrous consequences.
Following a shocking experience like being intimidated after making sincere abuse allegations, there may be no viable way to keep the victims or the parents of the victims from leaving the frum community. But the resilience of the neshama (soul) is truly miraculous, and even some of these extraordinarily determined survivors have managed to stick with their frum communities, to work toward significant change.
Baalei teshuva are often especially discerning. After all, we have taken the best from our backgrounds, then sought to incorporate that into the best way of life we’ve ever found. So we are discerning about what’s wrong with the standard frum lifestyle as well, and see no useful reason to ignore significant problems, whitewash, or cover them up.
Baalei teshuva often are used to politeness and friendliness from our previous incarnations. Exemplary friendliness, like greeting newcomers to shul, seems unfortunately to take a back seat in many frum communities. After moving beyond the warm welcome of initial kiruv experiences, a ba’al teshuva may often be stunned by a lack of welcoming encounters thereafter. He may soon end up becoming acclimated to this less-than-sunny style or, hopefully, he may admirably try to upgrade the status quo with an infusion of his own warm ways, if they don’t become overly stifled.
There are many examples of how baalei teshuva, in a steadfast resolve for truth, have already affected frum communities. The demand for upgraded special ed services, more professional therapeutic standards, and even healthier eating patterns have been indefatigably and successfully advocated for by baalei teshuva previously schooled in ways that could substantially benefit the frum lifestyle. “Why acquiesce to children getting junk food and sodas as prizes in school?” baalei teshuva may, not surprisingly, ask. It is not at all easy to ruffle feathers and confront authorities that have become entrenched in some outmoded and harmful habits, but baalei teshuva are often now leading the way, thank G-d.
I guess it all comes down to this: there are some inappropriate behaviors in our frum communities that baalei teshuva may not tolerate as complacently as others, and we are more willing than most to take the initiative to work on constructive change. Whether it’s lax attitudes about yeshiva students smoking, a lack of outrage about perpetrators of abuse, or even just a general lack of ready smiles, we are the ones, more and more, gaining the confidence (and knowledge from the complex “Pilot’s Manual”) to get up there on our soapboxes, and work to clean up some acts.
The vast majority of us are sticking around, and when we come face to face with problems that need work, we don’t have to pretend all is fine and dandy, just as we couldn’t pretend that in our past lifestyles either. We’re sticking around because we’re family now, and when members of our family need help, we feel more committed to them than ever. We are here because we want to help make this extraordinarily worthwhile way of life even healthier, even happier and even more responsible.
We want to thank you for every single difficult effort you have ever made to preserve what’s most meaningful. Thanks to all you did, we were able to transform our lives and regain our heritage. We hope you can see that providing refreshing outlooks, generating renewed enthusiasm, and promoting increased accountability are some of the ways we have to give back to you. This striving for truth is certainly challenging, but that’s just what we have always been deeply yearning for — and we’ve never stopped. So keep those seat belts fastened — tightly. We want to keep soaring, G-d willing. May we have a long and exhilarating journey together.
Bracha Goetz is the Harvard-educated author of ten children’s books, including Aliza in MitzvahLand, What Do You See at Home? and The Invisible Book. To enjoy Bracha’s presentations, you’re welcome to email [email protected].
Wonderful article and long overdue. There is just one misconception here- I think that most frum people have the same opinions as the Baalei Teshuvah regarding corruption, special needs and eating healthy etc. There are Judy those few bad apples from our community that are always making the headlines, giving a different immpression on who we really are.
bunch of crap
we have to think of god before we d a aveira not of a baal tshuva
Not only baalei teshuva! Frum people are ALSO being turned off!!!
Al tiskakel b’kankan ale ma yeshe bo. Yes the peyes, gartel and strajmel don’t guarantee an erlichen Yid
There are bad apples everywhere; the only difference is, that our bad apples don’t do drugs (for the most part) or rape or murder.
Because many BT’s have an idealized sense of Jewish morality, they can often be shocked by poor, hypocritical and corrupt behavior in the religious community.
Unfortunately, many of those negative behaviors occur all too often, but not necessarily because people are observant but rather because of bad habits developed in the shtetle.
I remember an old Rabbi in Albany once telling me that in old Russia whenever there was a murder, the Czars police went to the gentile villages to find the perpetrator. If there was money stolen, they searched the Jewish villages.
All the bad behaviors discussed in the above article can be seen in all unassimilated Jews despite their level of observance.
Basically , its an Old country thing , not a religious thing.
Next time don’t oversell yourself.
The frum community are human just like anyone else, it’s just their principles that help them remain better. That dosen’t mean that everyone sticks to 100% of the principles.
I totally agree with the main points this article, even if some of her argument gets a bit side-tracked. I have also seen a tangential effect of what is described, with a number of BTs try to emulate FFBs and and in doing so mimic the perceived need to be ‘unfriendly’ in shul – of attempting to be frummer than frum. I also anticipate many of the same responses as that of #1 and #4 . Ahavas yisrael is not just a convenient platitude.
Just wondering, which public school has students that have more derech eretz than Jewish day schools?
The Jweish star always has articles that counter traditional jewish values and this is a new low.
The other day I was discussing with an “FFB” (as I am a “BT”) some despicable behaviors that are acceptable, or appear to be acceptable in the frum community. The FFB was shocked and mortified that as a BT, I was witness to some disgusting things by “yeshivish” people – (how can an FFB make such a hillul hashem in front of a BT). It appears as though she thought I am frum for people and not for G-d. I fail to understand why she expected me to go “off” just because I saw inappropriate and distasteful things, but she would never expect a FFB to go “off”…
Finally. I work in kiruv. All the money in the world can’t undo the damage that has been done in the past years. Notice to all those who work with non frum people- please just be a mench! I spend so much time just doing damage control!!
I agree that BT may have an idealised representation of chareidi society that is bound to be disappointed.
But the reality is that the chareidi world likes to entertain this idealised image of itself. Take this newsspot. Look what comments are published, which are not, how the articles are phrased, how facts are presented….
Look at the reactions when it turns out a chareidi is a criminal: either he is the innocent victim of an evil plot (see the latest riots) or the crime he did is not that bad (he defrauded poor people? That’s oshek, not geneiva, and oshek against a goi is permitted)…
Certainly there is room for improvement in everyone’s behavior but to compare frum yidden to the secular world and call that world more civilized is ridiculous and chutzpa. I have been a full time kiruv worker for the last 15 years and can say that the lack of values or decency in secular society is what drives people to tshuva more than anything. This article comes, most likely from an insecurity about her position in the frum community and that is unfortunate.
Yeah Yeah Yeah all we hear is how frum people cheat the govt and frum rebaeim are all molesters and frum teenagers are all drug addicts and all at risk etc….. all we hear is how bad frum people are, but let me tell you the truth the frummer they are the better they are in midos and everything else, look at all the chessed organizations that yes the frum all started. I can gaurantee you that most frum people have a more honest tax returns than the less frum. and its a fact. of course we have a tiny minority of black sheep but the big majority of the frum people are honest ehrlicher law abiding citizens who will do anything and everything to help fellow men. and enough of the frum bashing articles by even the so called askonim.
I would love this well educated and thought out woman to show me one school in the civilized goyish world the size of Lakewood or Mir that doesnt have massive security, drug and crime issues. How many of our yeshivos have had columbine massacres? What civilized wealthy community has communal charity organizations comperable to the poorest yiddishe community? They dont give their kids soda, they give them mind numbing TV, movies, video games etc. I could go on but is there a point?
And why does Vinnews give such self righteous better than you attitudes a forum to exploit their messed up opinion?
We all know that most frum people do set a good example, and as a community we hve a lot to be proud of. Why just today, a former billionaire – shomer torah umitzvos – used his own funds to fund employee pensons that were swindled by Madoff. It was a frum carpet mfr that continued to pay payroll when his plant burned. There are many more such stories. Anyone choosing to focus on those in the negative have deeper issues and should not be given such an open forum.
She’s right, of course, but, as a previous commenter said, the same goes for FFB’s too. There are sincere ones who can be turned off as well.
I actually think she was too tentative and guarded in what she wrote. She was too nice to the crooks and lowlifes among us. They deserve much stronger treatment.
there is something called the gadlus of klal yisroel i have heard many shmoozin on this take twp min to look at how good we are then rewrite the article thank you
Which gedolim have ever endorsed the kiruv movement???? it must be the ones that permited mrs. Goetz to educate in Harvard.
Get it straight Mrs. Goetz DAAS BAL HABAIS HEPECH MIDAAS TORAH.
Big deal I’m FFB and I’m turned off from the BTs that don’t want to accept the derech of our heimeshe rebbes that taught us that abisel krume shtick to support their mosdos is good
The fact remains that since the inception of time the jewish people have been held to a higher standard and rightfully so, because of our morals and way of life.
If you think about what a bal teshuva gives up to come back to hashem it is incredible. Now, when they look at the FFB, they too are expecting perfection which is understandable but unrealistic. I think that as FFB’s we must be cognizant of the fact that we are constantely being watched by Hashem as well as BT’s and gentiles and try and act appropiately.
To get turned of when seeing how frum people behave does not make sense for an adult(yes for children and teen agers) Is one frum because of the people around him or because he loves the Torah and Hashem?
Secondly, a BT expects more from the frum person because she made extreme changes in her own life for the better she most probably can’t understand how a ffb can’t also strive to be on a higher spiritual level. For that I don’t blame her.
Then again, the crooks overshadow the erlicheh yidden, Yes there are alot alot of feineh, erlicheh, mesiras nefeshdikeh yidden that do alot of chesed etc…To remain a frumer yid after the holocaust, deserves high honors.
I’d like 2 remind all the bt’s that mesirah is a much bigger aveirah than cheating the goverment of taxes that they cheat us! So just watch the direction u r taking, how about if u bt’s look a little better on out goodside have u seen in the secular community anything close to the chesed, charity, bikur cholim, gemachs, org, and all the other mitzvos we do? Or iu r onlý focused of some ppl trying to save their hard earned paycheck from the theivs called: goverment? Think about it!!!
ATTENTION EVERY ONE!!!!!
#1 baaley tshuve according to my understanding means, that they were doing all aveirus (sins) in the past, but for some reason they got an hirer tshuvah and that’s why they are doing teshuva now.
So who cares about the frum people, you do what is right to do!.
#2 the word frum has a lot of meanings, so 1 wrong or 100 wrongs dosent make anything rite
Chillul Hashem is wrong regardless of who’s watching it happen. That being said, many balei tshuva (aren’t we all, if not we should be) do tend to look at our community with a bad eye. Perhaps they still have a long way to go in their middos tovos.
Keeping mitzvohs bein adom LMakom is easy compared to improving your middos.
Looking at your fellow Jew with a good eye is extremely appreciated by Hashem.
So next time you notice a Jew doing an aveira, just remember he’s a human being with flaws just like you. Just as you wouldn’t want your flaws to define you, so you shouldn’t define your fellow Jew by his flaws.
I am going to be harsh without even knowing the person I am about to criticize because she is far more harsh in tarring hundreds of thousands of innocent Jews when actually her aim is a small minority: The author, with her “them and us” perspective, has already started off on the wrong foot. Her patronizing tone is both unjustified and hence insulting and her reliance on anecdote and sweeping generalization betrays an arrogance and dooms any possibility of her message achieving currency where it is needed. Positing the false assumption that the affectations of gentility and knowledge equal true refinement is indicative of a shallow perspective and a total ignorance of history and the human condition. Unlike the insipid and saccharine world-view that predominates in contemporary “frum literature”, the ills of this world, for obvious reasons, resist any facile attempt at definition and solution.
These frum people have the same yetser horah as these balei tshuvas had to sin. please don’t judge an entire community on both sides for the actions of a few.
Have any of you posters who’ve lambasted BT’s for being disillusioned , bothered to consider the discrimination they face in the frum community? How many families, yeshivos, potential shidduchim are denied to BTs and their children because of who they were? You try living that life, becoming frum and dealing with such attitudes, and see how long you last!
First they were turned on by the sinners now they are turned off by the frum what’s their next step??
The defensiveness and harsh tone in many of the responses to this article are entirely unwarranted. To say that there is room for improvement in our behavior and habits should not evoke such paranoia. To cite just one example: We should applaud and follow the author’s suggestion that our Yiddishe kinderlach be fed and rewarded with nutritious snacks, and not junk food. All the more so must we protect them (and all the rest of us, too) from the corrupt behaviors she enumerates, which destroy souls, not just bodies.
“Kol haposeil, b’mumo poseil.” The commenters who accuse the writer of harshly misjudging others are themselves misjudging her constructive comments.
Tochacha from a BT:
1) Don’t talk so much in Shul;
2) Have good manners. It’s not proper to be rude;
3) Be honest in business;
4) Stop the strife within chassidic courts, including shameful physical confrontations.
From a BT:
the only reason to become religious is because the Tora is true. Human beings are just that, and sometimes we fail. Even Moishe Rabeinu failed!. Just read how the Rambam explains the ‘mei hameriva’.
A thief is a thief with or without tzizis and no gadol can maatir what is assur min hatorah Ends do not justify the means.
This is a balanced, sensitive article, and I happen to share the sentiments. As a working lawyer, I will testify there is much derech eretz in the secular world, in both Jewish and general circles. I tend to be an optimist, and I see the world changing for the better. Meanwhile, some of us in the frum world are sliding backwards. Tochechah is a mitzvah. We frum Jews are witness to grotesque aveiros never thought possible. Silence is not the answer. Hashem demands much more. I understand the need for some to remain anonymous, but can’t you at least be polite? Intended or not, you’re proving the point of the article.
If you’re not too busy, check out our web site: http://www.jewishadvocates.org.
They are looking for excuses. You cannot judge people by their looks. We have yetzer horas too! Maybe the BTs dont or they look at things differently since they became frum but its a whole ‘nother story.
Do I see “We hope you can see that providing refreshing outlooks, generating renewed enthusiasm, and promoting increased accountability are some of the ways we have to give back to you” THANK YOU THANK YOU THANK, PLEASE STOP GIVING BACK TO YIDISHKEIT ! We have great Tanuim, Amoiruim,Geoinim, VCHILI for that. Now I truly understand the Gemure BMUKEM SHBALEI TESHUVE OIMDIM……..how can one sit with such crap in one room? Balei Teshuve have a CHIP on their shoulder and it can’t be removed. OH ALMIGHTY, Please give us some SINNER’S………..Enough with the Balei Teshuve’s.
Its a piece of blony he has a big yatzer horah.and he trys to blaim it on chariede I also have a yeitzer hora and evrey time I do something rong I think of about 1000 reasons why I did it
B/S I once heard Rabbi Asher wayde(ger tzedek) speak and he said that on the first simchas torah he went to shul there were fist fighting over non-sense and when asked how come he wasn’t turned off by that behavier? These were his words “I don’t judge Hashem by his people, I judge Hashem by his Torah” of course good deeds and good people make it to news.
Turned off?how shallow and immature.One must do what is right and a baal teshuva realizes that the will of god does not change based on what others do.That is a cheap excuse and wil not help in the world to come.I am a FFB and hopefully also BT,we do daven 3x daily to do teshuva.People leaving superficial,gashmiyuth enveloped lives are no reason to be turned off
Example-how many people are aware that pursuing ta’avah like gorging at a chasunah or resturant will land you in gehinom?The smag one of the major rishonim explains that after doing all the mitzvoth and refraining from aiveroth,it all comes down to how one related to olam hazeh,did he use it as a vessel to olam haba or did he use it as a means to anend,to amass wealth power and enjoyment.True introspecting will reveal the answer for those seeking truth.But that requires major changes in hashkafa and in living standards.Getting ahead in life,is getting behind in lifeGiving to tzedakah,with its great zechuth is not enough.We most become more spiritual and focus on that.Those are the people who should turn us on,not FFB whom are barking up the wrong tree
I am not a BT (hate this termin) but a frim gevorner 🙂
A BT is a huge madreiga, which I doubt 85% of BT will ever reach.
#36-A+!!!
People see averos only from others…
However, since a so called BT knows good and well the smell of garbadge, he is more sensetive. Its a fact!
Nobody is perfect
This article has many good points. I can relate to this statement “Baalei teshuva often are used to politeness and friendliness from our previous incarnations. Exemplary friendliness, like greeting newcomers to shul, seems unfortunately to take a back seat in many frum communities.
While I joined by local Chabad congregation about 8 years ago, in the 1st few times of coming to the Shacharis service, I noticed many people not shaking my hand or not greeting with a “good morning”. I never knew the rule (I believe comes from the Shulcan Aruch) were one is not to greet his neighbor before praying to the King of Kings. Looking back, it would of been nice if someone would explain this to me (or break the small rule), since it would be a pretty good reason not to ever return to shul, since a novice would conceive the shul being unwelcoming.
I learned this from my rabbi: “Just because someone has a black hat and jacket, doesn’t make him frum or G-d fearing”. A person dressed in such garb, doesn’t make him immune to sins and transgression. Both him, the BT and others, are all responsible to answer to Hashem. It is my opinion, that the wrongful actions of an individual, frum or not, should not inhibit one in serving Hashem.
I’m a BT myself & all of us know that the secular world is a garbage can filled with greed and immorality where every last vip in society can’t be trusted by their own wife & children. we all know about all the drug usage anyone who can afford it does. the frum world is gold compared to what we left. the average secular child today is incapable of compleating a sentence without swearing. we’ve become BT because we realise the beauty of the frum way of life guided be the torah. the problems in the frum world are a tiny tiny percent & there are thousands of wonderful frum jews who dedicate their lives to helping correct these problems, that alone is something almost nonexistant in the secular world. & btw most of these wonderful people seem to be from the haredi community, so the MO & the rest of us BTs should stop the haredi slandering & begin to give them the respect they deserve
Interesting comments all around.Let’s remember that nobody is perfect and we are all “striving” to be better.R’ Moshe Chaim Luzzato did not write mesilas yesharim for anyone other than bnei torah.Why should it shock anyone that yidden,and specifically,frum yidden, deal with the nisyonos of gayvah ,tayva, and kovod and all of the challenges they bring. KEE ZEH KOL HAADAM.
This also explains,perhaps ,the way we tiptoe around other people’s misdeeds,even public ones.At the same time that we abhor their actions,we understand the underlying struggles that they are facing …that we all are facing in different areas of our lives.How and where to draw the lines of whether public comment is warranted and needed requires a unique perspective …a daas Torah.Sometimes the answer is to make a public outcry and sometimes it is better to say nothing,while still understanding that what was done was unacceptable.
Ahavas chinam goes along way in helping us in these matters.May we all have much hatzlocho!!
This needed to be said. If BT’s are being impacted negatively, imagine the Chululei Hashem that are being committed by frum Jews who engage in criminal behavior, such as tax fraud. By being money-corrupt, these crooks are playing right into the Gentile stereotype of the Jews as underhanded and money-hungry.
Well let’s put it this way there are no Drugs and no Weapons by the frum oilam of course you will say that Hoishiu as Drugs but the truth is there is no and by the Freie there are all of this stuff
Look, as a baal teshuvah myself (still struggling after 34 years), I still find it difficult sometimes when, in shul, during laining or chozores hashatz, people are talking. It is not just the guys in the back, but well respected members.
When my children when to the schools, the “angels” I sent came back with harsh words (like “dummy”) that had never been used at home.
I seem to be one of the only ones who *doesn’t* lie on my tuition reduction form. Now that my children are out of grade school and into Yeshivas it doesn’t bother me so much, but, I was told to “make up numbers”, since “the tuition committee expects everyone to lie some”.
I am still appalled by the overt (let alone the covert) racism that many in the frum community have.
I could go on, but think about this: Most of us became baalei teshuvah because of a searching for meaning. It is difficult for anyone (FFB or BT) who is sincere in their search for meaning and Hashem to see bad behavior among those who should be providing an example through speech and action.
I personally know the Goetz’s and they are an amazing family. They have mekarved a number of people into the community, and have a very special Shabbos table. They are focused on real sincere avodah, and not about putting on any airs.
My old rebbe in Israel (who is not BT) once expressed astonishment why BT’s try so hard to behave like FFB’s. He said they need to pave their own fresh inspiring path, and improve the frum community for the better.
Whoever goes looking for problems is going to find them. Hashem sends them to you to find out–well–who you are.
This article reminds me of the story about the couple visiting the Louvre who told their guide after the three-hour tour that, really, they were not so impressed. He told them, ‘Oh, you think that when you visit the Louvre, it is the Louvre that is being judged? Oh no! It is you who are being judged!’
Look for the good in all Jews and you’ll find it. And that will make you a better person…
This is exactly the reason Baal T’shuvas are not very accepted in our circles.
Why did they leave their goyishe world? Obviously they were not tzfridden with that way of life.
The reason you might see a story in the news against frumma yidden, is only because the case it is out of the ordinary…. and also because of antisemitism to show that the jews are not so perfect as the world thinks of them.
If you read the news about the goyishe world, there are so much bad going on that even the goyim are not happy. Look at the schools, even in the suburbs, where the bessera goyim live. All full of drugs, rape, and even murders of teachers. There is absolutely no derech eretz in the goyishe schools. the teachers fear for their lives.
Where do we have ANY of this in our schools and cheder??? The goyim do not even believe when you tell them that drugs are ZILCH in our schools. And no violence etc. etc.