JERUSALEM (VINnews) — A stunning conversation took place between a well known proponent of the anti-vaccine movement in Israel and a vaccine supporter, both Charedim.
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During the heated phone call, anti-vaxxer Rabbi Dr. Yoav Alon debated Itcha Dzalovski, who is in charge of the Health Ministry’s Charedi phone hotline. The discussion, as reported on Charedi news site Kikar Shabbos, offered a fascinating insight into the mindset of Covid vaccine opponents. Rabbi Alon staunchly asserted that Gedolei Yisrael are being misled and given false information. He also said that Klal Yisrael is headed for catastrophe.
Rabbi Alon said, “I am sure that these vaccines are very dangerous for Am Yisrael and the leadership we have today in the guise of Gedolei Torah is very dangerous for Am Yisrael. We are heading for catastrophe. The new world order really wants to destroy us. These vaccines are really very dangerous. Giving them to five-year-olds is crazy.”
Rabbi Alon added that one of his goals is to show people that there are Gedolim who oppose Covid vaccines.
Mr. Dzhalowski asked if Rabbi Alon believes that the many Gedolim who support vaccines are making a mistake, including Rav Chaim Kanievsky, Rav Gershon Edelstein, the Gerrer Rebbe, the Vizhnitzer Rebbe and others.
Rabbi Alon replied that they are surely mistaken in their support for the vaccines. .
Mr. Dzhalowski accused Rabbi Alon of misleading certain Gedolim into believing that Covid vaccines are unsafe. He suggested that he and a group of “anarchists” are manipulating leaders into believing nonsense.
Rabbi Alon defended himself by saying that there are Gedolim who agree with him, such as Rav Malkiel Kotler and Rabbi Yosef Binyamin Wozner, and he asked why they are being ignored.
Mr. Dzhalowski replied that there are many more Gedoim who support vaccines, and that it is more likely for a handful of Rabbonim, who do not have medical opinions backing them up, to be misled.
At one point, Rabbi Alon said that he was told that Mr. Dzalowski had not been vaccinated, and asked if that claim was accurate. Itcha replied, “Of course I’ve been vaccinated, three doses. Do you think I’m crazy? Do you think I would listen to nonsense from people whose thinking is distorted?”
Of course the gedolim are being misled. This has been going on for years. The answer reflects the question. Always. It depends what and how you ask the question. If the doctors come and tell r chaim that the vaccine is 100% safe and 100% effective the answer is gonna be take the vaccine. But if you don’t believe the doctor then the psak is worthless.
That being said I’m not an anti vaxxer and I don’t believe people are dying in the streets from the vaccine but if you think it’s definitely 100% safe like the doctors are saying your crazy. Because even they’ll admit that they have no idea about long term effects. So therefore it boils down levels of risk. Would you take the risk of getting covid or take the risk of getting vaccinated. So the answer to that is it depends who you are. That’s all. Simple
Not sure what’s so stunning about this. It’s no secret that or gedolim have no medical knowledge on this and are being fed selective information on the topic.
Natural Immunity is still better.
And you give it to kids is crazy,
Kids aren’t is much danger from Covid.
“Mr. Dzhalowski replied that there are many more Gedoim who support vaccines, and that it is more likely for a handful of Rabbonim, who do not have medical opinions backing them up, to be misled” anybody else sees the hypocrisy? Only his gedolim have medical backgrounds, what a joke.
If your best evidence is a RY who along with his rebbitzen have long advocated against the MMR vaccine, I’ll see what’s behind Door #2 .
I’m not an anti-vaxxer; I think vaccines are miracles of modern medicine, BUT:
“Mr. Dzhalowski asked if Rabbi Alon believes that the many Gedolim who support vaccines are making a mistake, including Rav Chaim Kanievsky, Rav Gershon Edelstein, the Gerrer Rebbe, the Vizhnitzer Rebbe and others.”
There is no question that, if any of these Rabbanim did actually issue a halachic psak to get the shots that, then they have been given false information. But Rav Chaim is a different story. He simply never said it.
I love it! Can VIN get a hold of the call? Please!
No news in this article, just 2 hot heads arguing, with no one interested in the truth, but I will not hold my breath waiting for a fair debate, as no news agency that wants to sound “normal” will give a anti vaxxer the chance to voice his concerns. Welcome to the freedom of press 2021
Shev veaal taaseh
When in doubt stay out.
I did not take any vaccines and neither have my family or friends. There are rabbonim on both sides. Elu veilu
If corrupt governments tell us to take vaccines why in the world would I listen to them? That’s basically what the rosh yeshiva of brisk said, he said anything Zionists ask you to take because of pikuach nefesh is a sakana
What vaccine??
I don’t know of any vaccines. When they finally create something that works longer than 3 months and prevents infection+transmission, LMK and I’ll register.
fyi Rabbi Dr. Yoav Alon is not a medical doctor and does not have a medical degree. His degree, from half a century ago, is in physics.
Rabonim make decisions involving science OFTEN. End of life, Shabbos,fertility,DNA come to mind. Either you accept the concept that a Rav has the responsibility to pasken on a wide variety of issues, including scientific issues, or you don’t. In other words,either you have kabalos ol or you don’t.
The initial vaccine was fine. But there is zero reason to give it to kids. And by the way, most of the Omicron cases are people who have been “boosted”. The endless boosters are causing the variants. Stop with the boosters!!!
One tribe of 12 wasn’t enslaved by Egyptians bc they saw thru the lies. Same for the sliver who escaped Europe before the Holocaust bc they saw the writing on the wall. Same now for our generation, only the small minority of us who correctly read the vaccine situation will emerge alive at the other end of this tunnel.
So Daas Torah is the authority. Except when one disagrees with Daas Torah.
Everyone is entitled.
The emergency rooms are full of seriously ill Covid 19 patients who weren’t vaccinated. Meanwhile, this childish debate continues. Facts don’t get in the way.
Alon’s main point in this interview, if you listen to the hebrew, is that the vaccine is the product of a New World Order conspiracy led by Bill Gates, to kill people off in the interests of population control and world dominance by Bill Gates and his cronies. They were also responsible for secretly sterilizing women in Kenya through vaccines.
Alon is saying that while the Rabbonim might have consulted with scientists, they have not consulted with people like himself, who are knowledgeable about this New World Order conspiracy.
If you doubt he’s saying this, and if you doubt that this is the type of person who some in the haredi world are taking seriously, listen for yourselves.
The opinions of gedolim are interesting and worth considering, but NONE carry the weight of a psak halacha.
These anti vaxxers are a dangerous bunch of lunatics the world is crazy only these misguided and yes uneducated no the truth
insane. open your eyes and see people getting sick and dying are not vaccinated.
IM a doctor and see it –
Hashem should help his mental illness
Tragically, seems it will take Yiddishe korbonos, rachmono litzlan, for Rabbi Alon to be proven correct – along with countless respected, prominent and brilliant doctors and research scientists world-wide, whose warnings and writings are deliberately being suppressed and censored.Yidden, wake up! There is an evil agenda here.
Why do we even give this guy a forum to be a rodef by claiming that the vaccine is a danger? What utter nonsense. Is he going to take responsibility to support the yesomim of those that listen to him?
What kind of a doctor is he anyway?
Great! So now our discussion around vaccine risk benefits is about my rabbi vs. your Rabbi, real smart. #TheGreatDaasTorahHoax
the fact that someone cannot fathom that jews should not be the first ones to have a vaccine tested on them, out of concern of annihilation, shows their ignorance and stupidness.
the fact that someone cannot fathom that the phrase we say, v’hee she’amdah laavoseinu, that they try to annihilate us in every generation, might actually be true, means the person is ridiculuous, childish, stupid, asinine, idiotic, and dangerous.
Just because the holocaust happened in the last hundred years, does not mean it can’t happen again.
to dive headfirst into a ‘test,’ that is being tested on jews, by a greek man, albert bourla, and endorsed by an italian, anthony fauci, shows your stupid ignorance of history and the annihilation of the jewish people.
The holocaust did not last a few months, it lasted a few years. At the beginning, nobody thought it would end the way it did.
I am not saying THIS is it for sure. I am saying IT WILL be attempted again, if it hasn’t happened already, because Eliyahu Hanavi, the author of the Hagada, tells us it is so. Do you argue on him?
It is not wrong to be wary, to do anything else other than to be wary, is living like an ostrich with your head in the sand, or to be like a horse with blinders, forgetting about the last 2000 years.
The word “Rabbi” should be in quotes.
The thumbs up and thumbs down should not cancel each other out. Each should be tallied separately.
It is not difficult for anyone to make up 30 accounts, and whitewash what someone is saying, out of spite, boredom, and just plain being a mazik.
Baruch Hashem, someone has the courage to inject some truth in this universe. Your body, your choice, however, I won’t commit suicide by vaccinating.
Most American big name rosh yeshivas, r ebas and Charedi rabbonim have been either anti vaccine or at least very neutral and not at all encouraging to take it.
Is it possible that more charedim in America got it already vs in ey, henceforth herd immunity plus we have the protection? Ey is not a much of a democracy as the USA and there are more shutdowns too . Are there other factors in play? Is it really just that most of the Americans are ignoring science but a gadol like R Chaim gets it? I don’t know . And I am not stating an opinion either way. I am merely stating a fact that most American charedim are anti vax.
Oh am one opinion worth noting, if you want American charedim to get vaxed, conduct community outreach. Get the rabbis to promote vaccines. Imagine a picture if he satmar Reba getting the jab! The idea that mandates will force us to anything is dumb and ludicrous. It’s not soviet Russia and people just go the other way. Only people like Steve out to get us vs actually out to achieve results, believe coming down like a bully helps. It’s just dumb strategy
the anti vacciners are disgusting – i dont care if they are chareidi.
listen to the doctors, not the so-called rabbis.
if they were true to their calling, these “rabbis” would urge everyone, for pikuach nefesh reasons, GET VACCINTATED
p.s. stop calling them ‘gedolei’ – they are NOT !